4 pane comic of dolan on the left and spooderman on the right

pane 1 (dolan): cum join opensurce cummunity!
pane 2 (spooderman): shure! how joyn?
pane 3 (dolan): Here discord! (with discord logo)
pane 4 (spooderman with tears in eyes): y u do dis?

  • CliveRosfield@lemmy.world
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    9 months ago

    Half this thread is mad discord saves messages and the other half is mad that discord doesn’t save messages. You can’t make this shit up lmao.

    I’ll eat all the downvotes but objectively discord is the best chatting service available to the public for discussion. Blows irc out of the water easily. The only point I’ll concede on is the phone number bullshit but otherwise I’d take it over anything else.

    Never had issues using their search feature for dev discords. It’s keyword based; truly stupid simple and easy to follow.

    And yes I’ve used irc actively. It’s delusional to think that is somehow easier to follow.

    • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      9 months ago

      the irony here is that discord quite literally has quantum state messages/posts, unless you NAIL the search perfectly, you’re gonna get everything but the exact message you wanted. I mean sure the keywords make sense, but try searching for two or three keywords in a server with tens of thousands of message, or better yet, not knowing what specific keywords to use.

      i can’t tell you the amount of times i’ve tried searching for an embed with words only to realize that apparently, discord is completely incapable of searching through embed names.

      Discord is alright as a chat platform, would actually be better if it were a universal platform base, like matrix, or get this, IRC. Not being stuck on a shitty broken electron app would nice from time to time.

    • 13617@lemmy.world
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      9 months ago

      The search has issues but I don’t fuck with irc channels because there is literally NEVER anyone there. I don’t understand IRC, either. I’m young, sorry

      • TechNom (nobody)@programming.dev
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        9 months ago

        IRC would have been the best tool if it did session logging instead of requiring the use of bouncers. IRC is text-only, nonproprietary and completely distraction-free.

        But you don’t have to use IRC. There are more modern federated protocols like Matrix and XMPP that do session logging. There are quite a lot of FOSS communities on them that are very active.

        However, the main complaint here isn’t about Discord vs other chat protocols. It’s about the use of Discord as a community support forum. Unlike forums like Discourse, Discord messages aren’t searchable on the web. If a person asks a question on it and gets a solution, it’s then lost forever. Another person with the same question has to ask again. It completely defeats the utility of FOSS - of reusing someone else’s solutions.

    • mexicancartel@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      9 months ago

      Telegram would be much better if you want some chat based discusstions. Search indexable forums are the best to find help

      • EngineerGaming@feddit.nl
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        9 months ago

        I don’t think it is better at all. Unlike Discord, which might allow you to exist without a phone number, Telegram requires it right upfront. And it removed the ability to register from desktop, at least without spinning up an Android VM.

        • mexicancartel@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          9 months ago

          Managing chats and pinning rules/important info in single chat is much better imo to “manage” a chat community. I agree your points though

    • StarkZarn@infosec.pub
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      9 months ago

      I’m not sure you understand what “objectively” actually means… Care to provide your data in support of your objective conclusion?

      • CliveRosfield@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        Sure.

        • FREE with zero maintenance or resources required on my end since day 1
        • All messages and uploads are saved and searchable to anyone who joins a discord server. Some of my servers are from 2016 and all 100k messages up to this day are still there with each and every file untouched whenever I search for something. Same thing if I join a new server.

        No other app has these two points along with the incredible amount of features and QoL Discord has. This is objectively true.

        • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          9 months ago

          this is not explicitly true, moderation is still a labor requirement.

          Messages get deleted from bans, channels wipes cause problems, sometimes discord just decides people shouldnt exist anymore.

          • CliveRosfield@lemmy.world
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            9 months ago

            Moderation is a requirement with anything involving people so I don’t see that as a discord specific problem. If anything it’s easier than a forum since I don’t have to deal with spam bots myself for the most part.

            The channel wipe thing is fair. You’re right about that.

            • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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              9 months ago

              i dont see how it would be easier on discord, discord is literally known only for bot/hacked account issues. I’ve never seen a spam bot on a forum before.

              Plus nobody is likely to target a forum, everybody is targeting discord already. And on top of that the discord banning/automoderation isnt great, i’ve heard its getting better though.

              • CliveRosfield@lemmy.world
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                9 months ago

                I follow a niche community and the recent bans for their board is all spam bots even in 2024. I don’t want to put up with that nonsense and discord actively tries to curb that so the choice is easy.

                • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                  9 months ago

                  idk you’d have to compare it between a few forums, and a few discord servers of the same size in order to figure it out.

                  I’d still be surprised to see people actually botting forums. It really just doesn’t make any sense.

        • 418teapot@lemmy.world
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          9 months ago

          Good for you, you have a short list of requirements out of a chat service and discord perfectly fills your niche. But different people have different requirements for chat, and they don’t align. And network effects force people who have differing requirements to use the service with the most users which sucks.

          For instance here are things that I require from any chat service that I use that discord completely falls flat at:

          • Ability to run it on my linux machine without using an electron client (npm is a huge mess of supply chain attacks and I refuse to run any software that is likely to contain dependencies from it)
          • Ability to run it on my AOSP phone which does not have any google play services installed
          • Ability to write software to back up messages without fear of a company changing their API and breaking my backup system
            • CliveRosfield@lemmy.world
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              9 months ago

              Just join a server, find your answer, and leave. Why is that so scary? You don’t even have to interact with anyone.

              • TechNom (nobody)@programming.dev
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                9 months ago

                That lazy culture is exactly why discord is bad for the job. I search for solutions first, instead of barging in with a question that may have been asked and resolved a thousand times before.

                  • TechNom (nobody)@programming.dev
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                    9 months ago

                    I can’t understand how the people advocating for Discord in place of support forums can be so tone deaf about the core complaints others have about Discord.

                    Discord’s search feature is worthless to me and a huge section of others. The search results don’t show up on web searches. Web search indices are important because they aggregate information from many sources. Forums like Discourse don’t have that problem. With Discord, you instead have to install a shitty electron app and register an account just to do the above mentioned search. Sometimes, they even force you to give them your phone number. No - I don’t want to do that for every software problem I need to resolve. Even plain mailing list archives are miles ahead in that aspect.

                    Meanwhile, the community discussions are stuck inside a proprietary silo that appears convenient until the company decides to profit from it through eventual and inevitable enshittification. At that point, the rest of the world will be left looking for a way to free those discussions.

          • CliveRosfield@lemmy.world
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            9 months ago

            At the end of the day all of the reasons you stated maybe <1% of people care about and most of the points have nothing to do with the chatting features itself. If I’m honest it’s basically paranoia and fear for the insanely low chance something goes slightly wrong. It’s like refusing to leave your house because you can spontaneously get struck by lightning. 🤷

            Whatever solution you’re using I would bet most people would find incredibly annoying to use from a usability perspective. As it would lack the 8 years worth of features and QoL discord introduced.

            So we have a philosophical difference and that’s that.

            • 418teapot@lemmy.world
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              9 months ago

              Agreed, but my point is with a centralized network the lowest common denominator wins. There is no reason you can’t have QoL features on an open network, and thusly let everyone have the features that they care most about.

              Can you imagine what a shithole the internet would have been if email wasn’t federated an open? There is absolutely no way that whatever centralized bullshit would have spawned instead would already be either long gone or enshittified to the point of being useless.

        • xigoi@lemmy.sdf.org
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          9 months ago

          Do you want to alienate users who are banned from Discord or don’t want to use proprietary software?

          • CliveRosfield@lemmy.world
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            9 months ago

            Yup. I am not giving up that convenience for a tiny fractional minority. They’re the ones wanting to die on a hill over a trivial problem not me.