Carnap’s statement is false, humans find all sorts of non-verifiable beliefs and experiences cognitively meaningful.
I think Carnap’s conception of “meaningful” differs from the “cognitively meaningful” term you use here. Which from context, I gather means something like “personally fulfilling” or “socially important”. Carnap along with the other logical positivists were trying to develop a philosophy of science that didn’t depend on metaphysical claims and was ultimately grounded in empiricism. Carnap’s use of the term “meaningful” is more akin to saying that a concept can be connected to the empirical world. Meaningless claims, then are the opposite, they cannot be connected to the empirical world.
Imagine for example that you and a friend were the victims of an attempted mugging turned violent, but to you and the mugger’s surprise you discovered that you were impervious to attacks with lead pipes and laser guns. As you are searching for an explanation for these newfound powers your friend suggests that the reason you have these powers is that you both, without your knowledge, are wearing magical rings that give you super powers, but the rings are invisible and cannot be felt by the wearers. Carnap would say that is meaningless because the ring explanation cannot be connected to the empirical world. The explanation requires an imperceptible entity.
Trying to draw a bright line between empiricism and metaphysics is not scientism, in the pejorative sense that you mean here. I think to qualify as such Carnap would need to dismiss all meaningless (in Carnap’s sense of the term) propositions as totally lacking in personal value. I don’t know his writing well enough to say whether or not he holds that view, ( a brief reading of his entry in the Stanford encyclopedia of philosophy suggests, no he did not hold those views) but I don’t think that conclusion is a particularly charitable reading of Carnap’s criticisms of metaphysics.
I didn’t introduce the term “cognitively meaningful” - it’s in the comic we’re all replying to.
This pretense that myself and others don’t understand what’s trying to be said is faulty. The comic would have worked had it said “substantively meaningful” instead…
…but my point (fuck Carnap, he’s not here, and people need to think for themselves and present their own opinions from time to time) is that in human collective societies, truth claims themselves are as meaningful as they are broadly believed - or at least discussed.
That is dealing in some sense of human social meaning (and is also a statement on how hard it is to avoid each other these days). Where as logical positivists are trying to approximate some statement about the validity of perceptions of the universe, perceptions which which themselves can’t escape our human contexts for understanding them.
So the logical positivists are discussing tools for gathering meanings the universe immediately cooperates with, where as I’m discussing what humans will co-operate with (and hence what is cognitively meaningful to our social brains). Which I find more interesting… As logical positivism is a boring, old, basic, and unavoidable premise for any reasonable person.
I’m superior, because I found an errant word in the comic and made a bunch of commenters online actually have an interesting discussion. :P j/k
Imagine for example that you and a friend were the victims of an attempted mugging turned violent, but to you and the mugger’s surprise you discovered that you were impervious to attacks with lead pipes and laser guns. As you are searching for an explanation for these newfound powers your friend suggests that the reason you have these powers is that you both, without your knowledge, are wearing magical rings that give you super powers, but the rings are invisible and cannot be felt by the wearers. Carnap would say that is meaningless because the ring explanation cannot be connected to the empirical world. The explanation requires an imperceptible entity.
Trying to draw a bright line between empiricism and metaphysics is not scientism, in the pejorative sense that you mean here. I think to qualify as such Carnap would need to dismiss all meaningless (in Carnap’s sense of the term) propositions as totally lacking in personal value. I don’t know his writing well enough to say whether or not he holds that view, ( a brief reading of his entry in the Stanford encyclopedia of philosophy suggests, no he did not hold those views) but I don’t think that conclusion is a particularly charitable reading of Carnap’s criticisms of metaphysics.
I didn’t introduce the term “cognitively meaningful” - it’s in the comic we’re all replying to.
This pretense that myself and others don’t understand what’s trying to be said is faulty. The comic would have worked had it said “substantively meaningful” instead…
…but my point (fuck Carnap, he’s not here, and people need to think for themselves and present their own opinions from time to time) is that in human collective societies, truth claims themselves are as meaningful as they are broadly believed - or at least discussed.
That is dealing in some sense of human social meaning (and is also a statement on how hard it is to avoid each other these days). Where as logical positivists are trying to approximate some statement about the validity of perceptions of the universe, perceptions which which themselves can’t escape our human contexts for understanding them.
So the logical positivists are discussing tools for gathering meanings the universe immediately cooperates with, where as I’m discussing what humans will co-operate with (and hence what is cognitively meaningful to our social brains). Which I find more interesting… As logical positivism is a boring, old, basic, and unavoidable premise for any reasonable person.
I’m superior, because I found an errant word in the comic and made a bunch of commenters online actually have an interesting discussion. :P j/k
Either that or I’m a kind of troll.