“Old people can’t be ageist against young people”.
Is basically what you are saying.
I’d very much like to hear you explain how that is your takeaway from what I said.
Older people have more cardiac-related problems because they’re old, and things just wear out.
Which would fall under the category of age-related health issues I mentioned that is one of the special considerations their specific demographic needs special attention paid to. People of any age can keel over of a genetic defect, and addressing those kinds of issues helps everyone, but it doesn’t address the specific issue of a 70 year old with a worn-out ticker with no genetic issues, and so there also needs to be attention paid to those specific issues that don’t affect young people. Just as addressing mental health issues helps everyone not get shot by cops but doesn’t address systemic racism, and how improving voter turnout overall is good but may not be enough to specifically get younger voters to turn out in similar numbers to older ones.
the problem here, is that this rhetoric is a prelude to “those damn kids didn’t vote and that’s why we lost”.
And how wild would it be if those damn kids actually turned up and voted in unprecedented numbers, took this election by storm, and kept doing so for the rest of their lives turning politics on its fucking head, making politicians have to cater to them and subsequent young generations? It’s only a prelude to that if 1. The younger people in fact don’t vote and 2. The election is lost by a margin that could have been made up by those youth voters, and if both of those things happen, it would in fact be true that it’s one of the reasons the election was lost from a numbers perspective, millennials and Gen z could be one of the biggest voting blocks, we have the numbers to call the shots if we just turn out and vote, but we don’t.
You want to make sure young people’s voices are heard? Then listen to them.
I’m listening, hell, I’m looking forward to hearing your rebuttal to this, the problem is that what matters isn’t getting some rando on the internet to listen to you, you need to get politicians to listen to you, and unless you have the money to throw around and buy them like big companies, lobbyists, and billionaires can do, the only way to get them to listen is by using your vote.
Pointing fingers rarely is persuasive or motivational
And sticking your fingers in your ears and yelling when someone says something you don’t like doesn’t exactly leave you very open to being motivated or persuaded, and yet here we both are doing weird things with our fingers.
And sticking your fingers in your ears and yelling when someone says something you don’t like doesn’t exactly leave you very open to being motivated or persuaded, and yet here we both are doing weird things with our fingers.
See: the DNC acting like they can coast to a 2024 victory, 2016 style.
Ageism would be if you refuse to hire someone who’s over 65, or insure them, or …. (Snip)
The proper definition of ageism is
any form of discrimination based on age.
While on its face, your example is indeed ageism, or rather actions predicated on ageist prejudices, the specific inclusion of an age requirement implies anything outside that age limit is fine.
Which, yes, young people are frequently barred outright from getting jobs they are otherwise qualified for, in favor of older candidates that are frequently less qualified. Especially in management or executive roles.
As for your cardiac example, again, it depends on the behavior that follows the totally benign statement of fact. For example, if you then berate people for not doing those things- regardless if there’s plenty of evidence they are- and totally ignoring the rather significant issue of genetics and economic factors (including access to healthcare and healthy food,)
And how wild would it be if those damn kids actually turned up and voted in unprecedented numbers,
You mean like they did in 2020? It’s not gonna be “wild”, because no generation is a monolith.
I’m listening, hell, I’m looking forward to hearing your rebuttal to this, …… (snip)…. the only way to get them to listen is by using your vote.
And you’re not going to motivate people- anyone- to vote by nagging them, berating, or callouts. In point of fact, that’s been my point all along: OP was ageist but didn’t need to be. It does more harm than good.
Which you’re not listening. Your telling me “no this isn’t ageist”, and all I hear is “BOHICA” because old people telling me to shut up and take their abuse has been a persistent fact of my life (and many millennials and gen z).
The reality is that 40% of all Americans don’t vote. The reasons that a higher proportion of seniors vote is that a higher proportion of seniors can vote.
I don’t mean legally. I mean, they physically have the ability to make time to vote (I.e., in 2022 26% of 65-75 are still working), have increased access to assistance to getting to the vote (there are programs specifically to help seniors with transportation to polls, or other help, and less resistance to seniors doing absentee or curbside voting.)
18-24 yo’s are likely still in school or working in jobs that don’t have easy-to-take time off (paid or otherwise,); are frequently attending non-local colleges and have significant difficulties getting back to vote or otherwise doing absentee ballots. Frequently they’re doing both school and working and simply don’t have the time.
So it should be expected that fewer make it to vote.
Saying “yeah you should vote” doesn’t really solve anything. Neither is it really all that motivational for people who “just don’t care”,
And sticking your fingers in your ears and yelling when someone says something you don’t like doesn’t exactly leave you very open to being motivated or persuaded
I’m yelling now? Or ignoring you?
What you’re saying isn’t persuasive. At least not to me. Congratulations on making that my fault though. Why is it my obligation to be open to be persuaded and not also yours?
65+ age groups have significantly improved polling access. Telling people to “just vote” when it’s significantly harder to get out to vote is sort of like telling people to “just go see your doctor” when they don’t have affordable access to one.
It does nothing to persuade, or motivate, just makes you seem condescending… and you kind of have to tailor the message to the recipients. Expecting a “just do it” message to go over well is a large part of how 2016 happened.
I’d very much like to hear you explain how that is your takeaway from what I said.
Which would fall under the category of age-related health issues I mentioned that is one of the special considerations their specific demographic needs special attention paid to. People of any age can keel over of a genetic defect, and addressing those kinds of issues helps everyone, but it doesn’t address the specific issue of a 70 year old with a worn-out ticker with no genetic issues, and so there also needs to be attention paid to those specific issues that don’t affect young people. Just as addressing mental health issues helps everyone not get shot by cops but doesn’t address systemic racism, and how improving voter turnout overall is good but may not be enough to specifically get younger voters to turn out in similar numbers to older ones.
And how wild would it be if those damn kids actually turned up and voted in unprecedented numbers, took this election by storm, and kept doing so for the rest of their lives turning politics on its fucking head, making politicians have to cater to them and subsequent young generations? It’s only a prelude to that if 1. The younger people in fact don’t vote and 2. The election is lost by a margin that could have been made up by those youth voters, and if both of those things happen, it would in fact be true that it’s one of the reasons the election was lost from a numbers perspective, millennials and Gen z could be one of the biggest voting blocks, we have the numbers to call the shots if we just turn out and vote, but we don’t.
I’m listening, hell, I’m looking forward to hearing your rebuttal to this, the problem is that what matters isn’t getting some rando on the internet to listen to you, you need to get politicians to listen to you, and unless you have the money to throw around and buy them like big companies, lobbyists, and billionaires can do, the only way to get them to listen is by using your vote.
And sticking your fingers in your ears and yelling when someone says something you don’t like doesn’t exactly leave you very open to being motivated or persuaded, and yet here we both are doing weird things with our fingers.
See: the DNC acting like they can coast to a 2024 victory, 2016 style.
The proper definition of ageism is
While on its face, your example is indeed ageism, or rather actions predicated on ageist prejudices, the specific inclusion of an age requirement implies anything outside that age limit is fine.
Which, yes, young people are frequently barred outright from getting jobs they are otherwise qualified for, in favor of older candidates that are frequently less qualified. Especially in management or executive roles.
As for your cardiac example, again, it depends on the behavior that follows the totally benign statement of fact. For example, if you then berate people for not doing those things- regardless if there’s plenty of evidence they are- and totally ignoring the rather significant issue of genetics and economic factors (including access to healthcare and healthy food,)
You mean like they did in 2020? It’s not gonna be “wild”, because no generation is a monolith.
And you’re not going to motivate people- anyone- to vote by nagging them, berating, or callouts. In point of fact, that’s been my point all along: OP was ageist but didn’t need to be. It does more harm than good.
Which you’re not listening. Your telling me “no this isn’t ageist”, and all I hear is “BOHICA” because old people telling me to shut up and take their abuse has been a persistent fact of my life (and many millennials and gen z).
The reality is that 40% of all Americans don’t vote. The reasons that a higher proportion of seniors vote is that a higher proportion of seniors can vote.
I don’t mean legally. I mean, they physically have the ability to make time to vote (I.e., in 2022 26% of 65-75 are still working), have increased access to assistance to getting to the vote (there are programs specifically to help seniors with transportation to polls, or other help, and less resistance to seniors doing absentee or curbside voting.)
18-24 yo’s are likely still in school or working in jobs that don’t have easy-to-take time off (paid or otherwise,); are frequently attending non-local colleges and have significant difficulties getting back to vote or otherwise doing absentee ballots. Frequently they’re doing both school and working and simply don’t have the time.
So it should be expected that fewer make it to vote.
Saying “yeah you should vote” doesn’t really solve anything. Neither is it really all that motivational for people who “just don’t care”,
I’m yelling now? Or ignoring you?
What you’re saying isn’t persuasive. At least not to me. Congratulations on making that my fault though. Why is it my obligation to be open to be persuaded and not also yours?
65+ age groups have significantly improved polling access. Telling people to “just vote” when it’s significantly harder to get out to vote is sort of like telling people to “just go see your doctor” when they don’t have affordable access to one.
It does nothing to persuade, or motivate, just makes you seem condescending… and you kind of have to tailor the message to the recipients. Expecting a “just do it” message to go over well is a large part of how 2016 happened.