Andreas Kling aka @awesomekling wrote:
We’ve been evaluating a number of C++ successor languages for @ladybirdbrowser , and the one best suited to our needs appears to be @SwiftLang 🪶
Over the last few months, I’ve asked a bunch of folks to pick some little part of our project and try rewriting it in the different languages we were evaluating. The feedback was very clear: everyone preferred Swift!
Why do we like Swift?
First off, Swift has both memory & data race safety (as of v6). It’s also a modern language with solid ergonomics.
Something that matters to us a lot is OO. Web specs & browser internals tend to be highly object-oriented, and life is easier when you can model specs closely in your code. Swift has first-class OO support, in many ways even nicer than C++.
The Swift team is also investing heavily in C++ interop, which means there’s a real path to incremental adoption, not just gigantic rewrites.
Strong ties to Apple?
Swift has historically been strongly tied to Apple and their platforms, but in the last year, there’s been a push for “swiftlang” to become more independent. (It’s now in a separate GitHub org, no longer in “apple”, for example).
Support for non-Apple platforms is also improving, as is the support for other, LSP-based development environments.
What happens next?
We aren’t able to start using it just yet, as the current release of Swift ships with a version of Clang that’s too old to grok our existing C++ codebase. But when Swift 6 comes out of beta this fall, we will begin using it!
No language is perfect, and there are a lot of things here that we don’t know yet. I’m not aware of anyone doing browser engine stuff in Swift before, so we’ll probably end up with feedback for the Swift team as well.
I’m super excited about this! We must steer Ladybird towards memory safety, and the first step is selecting a successor language that we can begin adopting very soon. 🤓🐞
Hey Ladybird — get off Xitter and use something else like Mastadon.
Weird fascist tech bro likes weird fascist tech bro platform
What the hell are you talking about? I have been following Andreas for few years already and in no way he is fascist, in fact he is one of the most wholesome people around that I know of.
Your comment convinced me to finally take a look at his profile and see what the fuss is about.
I didn’t see anything that’d make me scream fascism, either.
But there’s definitely stuff that’s off. Things that, in isolation, would be one thing, but when you analyze them all together, it wouldn’t be weird to say there’s a pattern. A picture starts to form, and it’s one that I’ve sadly seen many times before.
So I went back and grabbed a few tweets:
I barely had to scroll to find these, they’re all recent. There’s much more.
Individually, you could dismiss everything. It’s just humor. He’s neutral. Objective. Wholesome. But then, why does he keep hitting the same keys? You’d assume a wholesome centrist would have a little more variety in their stand-up routine.
You know what he reminds me of, after reading so many of his tweets?
People who dress up in a veneer of positivity, but you ask them what they think is negative, and they’ll say things like raising awareness of LGBT issues. Not in those words, of course, because that’s not positive. When they talk about it, they’ll put on this show about how they don’t take sides, and how they’re simply worried about the technical discussion, the actually important stuff, you know? They simply don’t like unhelpful noise, things like trying to foster an inclusive community.
It’s easy to seem like a positive figure when you never properly acknowledge any criticism. Position yourself as a factual, neutral voice of objectivity, even when that’s literally impossible. Present those who disagree as non-contributing, unproductive, negative noise-makers. Say you agree with people on topics they care about, but then turn around and tell them they’re all doing it wrong. Cover it all up in emoji and a “Let’s do it together!” attitude, but reject anyone who reaches out with the wrong greeting.
And there you have it, Andreas reads like a man who’s either lying to himself or to others, and I don’t know which is worse.
I went into this thinking, “I have to avoid baselessly criticizing people. There’s surely nuance to this man’s real beliefs, people on the internet are too quick to attack without evidence.” Which is why I’m honestly surprised to say that I came out with a mildly worse opinion of Andreas than when I started. What the hell.
I sincerely hope he can reflect on his behavior and grow out of this strange mindset. Andreas seems to be a great software developer and Ladybird can be an enormous boon for the web, so it hurts to see him acting this way.
Again, I genuinely don’t think he’s on Twitter because he’s a “weird fascist tech bro” who likes a fascist platform (what is even meant by weird?). I find it more probable that he’s comfortable there, realizes that it’s not going anywhere, that it remains the most popular platform, and therefore doesn’t think Mastodon is worth the effort.
Why he’s so comfortable there and doesn’t like Mastodon is worth considering, though.
This is literally the text from one of the links above that assert that Andreas is a fascist:
“I’m doing my best to build something I believe in, and everyone is welcome to participate as long as we can set our differences aside.
”
I cannot imagine how lopsided your world-view needs to be to interpret this kind of neutrality as “fascist”.
The only conclusion that I can draw is that some people are so polarized ( black and white ) that they can only interpret people that are not “with” them as “against” them.
And to clarify “with” above means “shares my extreme views and expectations”.
If that is true, it is tragically sad.
https://cmdr-nova.online/2024/07/03/serenityos-and-ladybird/
Lol, the person who wrote this is delusional. This shit have been already debunked, and if I remember correctly Andreas himself said that he might have handled the situation differently, but in the end he did a good thing and suppressed malicious person with theirs political agenda doing nothing to make an actual contribution, but instead focusing on very minor language issue.
These kind of people are causing no more than a trouble in open source community trying to force people into thinking there are problems that need fixing when in reality they do not exist, just to boost their ago or who knows what (I certainly don’t).
And come one “a fascist”? “a nazi”? Do people not know the meaning of these words anymore? He have never said anything regarding being pro or anti any identity (sexual or not), let alone bashing anybody for that matter. And even if he did, it doesnt’t make him a Nazi, but probably “just a misogynist and transphobe”.
And in fact why would saying “he” instead of anything else mean that someone is far-right in the first place? Or in fact what does it have to do with transexuality?
I must say as a person with mostly left-aligned views, some people on the left are living in some alternative or made up reality, because things they say have little to no logic. Or it’s just a nonsense made up only for the purpose of having excuse for hate. I don’t know exactly but this needs to stop. For greater good.
Having read all the context and the “debunking,” no, I don’t think that person is delusional. I think they’re just more sensative to how certain patterns of actions can be hurtful to marginalized groups than awesomekling is, and that awesomekling has showed a consistent pattern of associating with, and empowering, bad folks, and for not taking it seriously when people say “associating with bad folks makes the project less inclusive, and makes people less willing to contribute.” The justification he provides basically boils down to “Well you don’t contribute so I don’t have to listen to” when part of why people aren’t contributing is that they make first contributions and he offhandedly dismisses them. It’s interesting to me that “trans people exist” is a political agenda but “we refuse to acknowlege your pronouns and will change them with moderator powers on our discord” isn’t.
I disagree that people trying to make the language of technology more inclusive are doing nothing but causing trouble. They’re trying to make our communities more open to more contributors, and by slamming the doors in their faces we prevent them from continuing forward. And here’s the thing: I’ve seen this play out before. Really big, really successful, projects see consistent long term contributions and develop and grow over time. Projects that are harmful to marginalized groups get niche appeal but not mass adoption. Also whether or not he supports right-wing politics, I find it hard to take it seriously that someone who’s so “wholesome” is “just” a misogynist or a transphobe. Those are serious allegations, and ones that I haven’t seen well addressed, and ones I don’t care to associate myself with until awesomekling shows up and puts in the work to make it clear marginalized people are welcome working on his codebase. As of right now? It seems he’s perfectly willing to accept money and code from people who show consistent patterns of abuse.
As a left-aligned person, myself, I ALSO think we need to stop excusing hate, but I think that looks somewhat different.
Programming language: Swift - owned by big corp
Source forge: Github - owned by big corp
Communication channels:
👌
Anti Commercial-AI license
For comparison, Mozilla is on Twitter as well, but they’re also on mastodon and even went as far as deciding to host their own instance.