Related to the ForumWG topic of resolvable context collections, there are four FEPs that are currently in consideration:

  1. FEP-7888: Demystifying the context property
  2. FEP-400e: Publicly-appendable ActivityPub collections
  3. Draft FEP-171b: Conversation Containers, an evolution of Conversation Containers
  4. FEP-76ea: Conversation Threads

@[email protected] made a suggestion last month to hopefully reduce the number of moving parts:

  • Both FEP-400e and FEP-1b12 implementations: support FEP-7888 (context collection)
  • FEP-400e implementations: upgrade to Conversation Containers
  • FEP-1b12 implementations: add target property to Announce activity that points to context collection.

This takes FEP 400e out of the running (potentially). But the day after that last meeting, @[email protected] put together FEP 76ea, and now we’re back to three.

My concern is that all three FEPs (7888, 171b, and 76ea) all share these distinct qualities:

  • They establish a conversational context for a given object
  • They federate out an Add on collection addition. (76ea also sends Remove)
  • They contain some concept of a context owner (attributedTo)

They differ on the following qualities:

  • 7888/171b use context whereas 76ea uses a new property thr:thread
  • 171b specifies a new object type Context
  • Collection items:
    • 7888 sends objects in chronological order
    • 171b sends activities in chronological order
    • 76ea sends objects in reverse chronological order

In the lead up to the November WG meeting I’d like to address those differences. All three FEPs are in pre-draft or draft stages, and so I am hoping we can find some common ground and compromise.

Pinging interested parties (who were not already mentioned above) for comment:

@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]

  • julian@community.nodebb.orgOP
    0·
    9 days ago

    Hi @[email protected], thanks for your thoughts. I took the evening to think it over.

    I agree that using thr:thread would be the most explicit way of signalling that NodeBB topics are threads, and if 76ea were to be adopted by a majority of implementors, then I would reconsider. Currently I am on the fence about whether or not I should implement it.

    I do want to point out that @[email protected]’s FEP 7888 doesn’t expressly forbid multiple contexts, and I think upthread they even said that such a use case would not be contrary to the FEP:

    based on this conversation i probably need to add examples to fep-7888 of how one might process multiple contexts. ~ trwnh

    My opinion today is that when NodeBB uses context, it is doing so to signal that “hey, these posts are part of this collection”, and exactly nothing more. It is up to the receiving end to decide how to implement it, and I think that this sort of variety is absolutely wonderful.

    If, for example, someone were to see my context and say “I’d like to map this context’s objects out into a word cloud and do sentiment analysis on it”, I think that’s a perfectly cromulent use of the data. For me to say “this here is a thread, and you better treat it as a thread” is contrary to the spirit of ActivityPub and fedidevs in general.

    It would be like the ForumWG saying to Eugen, @[email protected], et al. that “we’ve decided that YOU, Mastodon, need to support as:Listen and render inline players, and playlist support, etc.”. That’s ridiculous, wouldn’t you agree?

    • Scott M. Stolz@authorship.studio
      1·
      9 days ago

      @julian

      If, for example, someone were to see my context and say “I’d like to map this context’s objects out into a word cloud and do sentiment analysis on it”, I think that’s a perfectly cromulent use of the data. For me to say “this here is a thread, and you better treat it as a thread” is contrary to the spirit of ActivityPub and fedidevs in general.

      Simply declaring a collection to be a thread does not force people to display it as a thread. But it does provide valuable information to people who do want to display it as a thread.

      So you are not removing people’s choice by simply stating that on your platform, this is considered a thread.