- cross-posted to:
- steamdeck@sopuli.xyz
- cross-posted to:
- steamdeck@sopuli.xyz
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The idea of a console where the manufacturer doesn’t have total control over the OS is ludicrous, no way a Windows box is ever going to “kill” the deck
Yeah, Sony lost me when they broke my Linux install and degraded the DVD playback functions, within six months of me buying my PS2. Similarly, the last “good” smartphone I had, was the Palm Treo (650p\680p\Centro); since then, I’ve never had a single phone that granted direct hardware access & allowed unloading/sideloading the OS by default.
Manufacturers want deep control these days; way beyond mere root permissions.
Difference between a console and a PC is that the OS is open source
And Arch is right fucking there
And Holo ISO if you don’t want to fully configure.
The internet connection is my limiting factor. 15GB or on lunch/break. 😭
Portal is crisp and clean.
I heard Fallout 4 is good.
OOTP could run on an XP machine from 2003.
Also funny how they keep adding shit no one needs that just makes battery life worse
Yes let me drop $700 on a handheld so I can play it plugged in on the couch
Remember Game Gear? Pepperidge farm remembers
The battery drainer? That thing was epi…
Sorry, ran out of batteries.
I knew people with NiMh batteries for their RC cars\planes\boats, but the first time I ever saw NiMh AAs, was in a GameGear.
Man that shit sucked. I only had one set so drive for 15 minutes then charge it till tomorrow
Yes! I had three NiCd to every one NiMH, & the NiCd would all be flat within minutes; then I’d switch to the NiMH for some actual fun & within 30 minutes they’re all spent for the day. Sometimes I stripped the single-use flat cells out of used Polaroid film packs, for just a few minutes of superior power:weight ratio on my littlest RCs
Then there were the flashlights we’d use for hours but if you put the same cells in the GameGear, dead in no time.
LiPo cells were like a revelation…
Come to think of it, the PSP had an optical drive which was a battery hog too; I remember a friend being elated that I’d found an aftermarket pack with more mAh.
Adding what exactly?
I think the rog ally had Microsoft word (maybe even just office) come with it.
Cool, so now it’s a “work laptop” and I can justify expensing it !!
Only reason why they’d put Word on it IMO
Oh yeah not very usefull there. But at least it can be uninstalled I guess…
According to the totally impartial LTT review of the Ally it’s worse than the Deck in every way but if it’s plugged in and you’re using a kb+m then it’s only a slightly underpowered laptop and you should totally buy it over the Deck
So I guess the “power modes” that can’t run on battery
What, are you saying this 7", 1600p, 120Hz display is a stupid choice for a handheld? How dare you!
Some people want that. I’ve never played my switch as a handheld. Not once.
Me neither. Maybe because I don’t own a switch, donno.
I’ve played mine on the TV like a half dozen times maybe. I mostly play it while I watch TV… why yes I do have rather severe ADHD.
Fucking hell the “Steam Deck killers” is a stupid trend.
They really do hit you with all the specs that are supposed to put the deck to shame, but the reveal their ludicrous price, completely ignoring the major advance the things has.
That’s a simple trick, but cheap and dirty, so it’s pretty garbo anyway. No respect for handhelds themselves or anyone reviewing them or taking any sponsorship that do anything like that.
Imho, the Steam Deck will be the only one with a really long product lifetime. Simply because Valve’s main business is selling games, not consoles. The Deck makes people buy more/different games. Worked on me. I haven’t played much in the last decade because I was too tired to play at my PC after work. Now I can play everywhere. Couch, bed, car, … Basically every other manufacturer makes money exactly once by selling such a console. As soon as their marketing is done with it, they’ll release a new revision and you won’t see a single software update for the old model ever again.
Yup, there are a number of features for Valve to do this right:
supporting linux frees them of the eternal windows shackles that pc-gaming has become, diversifies steam as a multi-platform service (not just pc gaming juggernaut) without encroaching on anyone else’s terrain, and gets their user’s enormous libraries out into the world, potentially enabling new kinds of games in the future.
Well, but the same is true for brands selling desktops or laptops with windows, where they only make money once on the hardware (and maybe some additional money by installing subscription crapware like mc afee etc.).
That’s true. And that’s the reason why you’ll get one or two firmware/driver updates and that’s it. These companies have work to do on the other hand. A laptos or desktop is a widespread product. Valve had to go a long way to make the Deck happen.
Wouldn’t it be rather simple to install Linux on them though?
You could, but what makes Steam Deck special is that it’s SteamOS is built specifically for that hardware, enabling functions you wouldn’t normally see in gaming PC hardware.
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At least one of the main features is seamless suspend/resume. Not sure what the state of that is on Windows but I’ve seen a lot of people mention that SD feature specifically.
There’s also the global framerate limiter. Pretty sure that’s impossible to do on Windows.
The AMD driver can cap your game framerate globally, 90Hz instead of 144Hz saves a lot of power but is still much smoother than 60Hz
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Small nitpick. I’m not sure why you don’t like the idea of the vendor having stuff installed on hardware they make, to ensure it functions optimally. Like, on a primary compute device, sure, be picky about the OS. But this is a game platform. Nobody gives a shit that Nintendo makes their own OS for their hardware, why does anyone care how the Steam Deck does it’s thing?
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Fair enough! I mean, that would be really nice tbh. Also it makes me realize that consoles only exist for DRM, which is sucky. Granted, I stopped buying consoles almost a decade ago, so I never stopped to think about it.
The difference is that if the device comes with Steam OS, then it’s ready to go out of the box and you’re assured the hardware has good Linux support.
If it’s originally a Windows device then you may have to jump through additional hoops to get everything working. Also you’ll have to deal with allowing other OS’s in the BIOS if it’s locked.
Also you’ve paid Microsoft for a license you won’t use.
The flip side is that there’s work to make native Steam OS build for 3rd party portable devices:
and
I suppose. But then why not steam deck?
If you like the hardware of one of the others more. I think the Legion Go looks pretty sweet. Wonder if it could make a good daily driver even.
I used the steam deck as a daily driver between laptops. It was good enough to the point that if I had a decent mobile monitor, I would consider it exclusively for a travel rig.
Outside of the better gpu, the one advantage the other devices have is emulation. Steamdeck sits on the edge of performance for some of the harder to emulate devices heavy titles (PS3, Switch). The ones using Ryzen 3/4 would trivially handle emulation better than the Steamdecks CPU, which uses Ryzen 1+ (part of the reason why its low cost)
I’ve got an external monitor and my full keyboard and mouse with a dock and my steam deck. I can set up anywhere with a desk and game, program, whatever. I’ve found very little that it can’t handle.
What monitor are you using? Can the dock drive it?
I’m using this portable monitor but it is kind of finicky, and I worry it’ll break easily. It’s the biggest one I could find at a reasonable price, and happens to fit my backpack.
I’ve used it with my 3440x1440 freesync monitor at home, and it works as well, but like anything, whether you can game at that resolution is very dependant on the specific game and settings you use.
I’ll add, because the deck doesn’t have thunderbolt, plan on using HDMI instead of type c. It’s possible you can find a type c (non-thunderbolt) dock that supports powering and driving a monitor over type c along with the deck, but I wasn’t able to find one.
I am looking specifically for a single device for travelling with. But the built in controllers of the Steamdeck are just a little too goofy for me to give it much serious consideration.
A tablet form-factor Steamdeck? I’d be sold.
You might think that. But consider that there will likely be fully functional keyboards via those same controllers.
I used mine for travel in business. it performed fine. It was nice to not have have a separate key board (although I did keep one with me).
I doubt I’m going to write much code on a controller I’m afraid.
Thats your business and your use case may differ. My use case is wearing leather jackets with shoulder pads while standing outside isolated telephone booths..
I really think if they keyboard was sufficient it would actually be kindof fun to program this way.
Totally agree.
Not only they can’t sell the device at a loss, but also they have to use Windows for driver compatibility.
What’s holding back the Steam Deck, and the whole gaming on the go, it’s x86. For the rest, it’s x86 plus Windows plus drivers.
The one to win will be who makes a tightly coupled device that’s also efficient. Apple is good at that, but has nowhere near the catalogue than Steam and lacks a Steamworks SDK.
Intel meteor lake looks very appealing for next Gen consoles
I’ve heard that story a lot of times. Also, next gen consoles are going AMD unless Intel bows really down, which I haven’t seen in my lifetime.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen consoles use Intel in history.
Wasn’t the OG Xbox an Intel machine running some stripped down Windows install?
Yes it used a Pentium III clocked at 733Mhz iirc.
Where are the true killers with arm based chips? And how is the linux version of rosetta 2 doing? Can we run x86 games on arm Linux?
And how is the linux version of rosetta 2 doing?
What? You mean how is the linux version of mac version of qemu? Alive and kicking! Same for box86 and box64. Binary tralsators existed before Apple started making x86 computers.
Sorry, i was very late with this whole arm hype 😅 never knew that rasp pi was arm prior Apple silicone 🫣 But Indeed, it is very nice seeing that fast progress there and I hope linux arm goes mainstream and thus get even more supported by app developers and investors.
Don’t Apple’s chips have specific hardware support to make Rosetta 2 as effective as it is? I’ve been really hoping other manufacturers find a way to do something similar.
Yes they do, and you can bet that’ll go away as soon as Apple thinks x86 isn’t important (to them).
I don’t know about hardware support, but I found this article on box86.org which seems to be the best alternative to rosetta on Linux. The performance drop on box64 vs native is still much greater than the performance drop in rosetta:
https://box86.org/2022/03/box86-box64-vs-qemu-vs-fex-vs-rosetta2/
Edit: many infos about Rosetta under the hood: https://github.com/FFRI/ProjectChampollion
I found nothing, that implies that there would be specific hardware features in m1 for making the translation faster. Only that it does translation mainly ahead-of-time (AOT) and saves “that version” of the app somewhere as cache). I only scrolled through it and did not read it all, so maybe I missed it.
I thought that valve even allowed other companies to use the steam deck software on their own hardware.
I’m pretty sure its just a linux distro anyone can use, maybe even open source.
Manufacturers will choose the sweet microsoft money tho they get per device with windows preinstalled.
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I think GPD offers SteamOS copies for their devices.
That’s because normal Linux won’t be as optimised but unlike Valve they don’t want to put actual work into optimising it.
Less “not optimized”, & more “not supported”; IE, accelerations that don’t turn on, because companies like Intel, Broadcom, Samsung, & NVidia, have a long history of only giving preferred partner devteams, prerelease hardware access, much less any peeks at unobfuscated firmware.
Not so bad if you can just install another OS to 'em like they were just little mobile computers.
if I don’t own any steam games, are any of these other options better than the steam deck? or is steam deck still the way to go for non steam games?
They have better performance, so if you play plugged in or play a game that’s not great in Proton you might benefit.
For unplugged, nobody has yet beat the 5W performance of the Steam Deck
I mean it doesn’t have a disc drive and the base OS is Linux, so if the game you want to play doesn’t work on Linux it won’t work on the Linux version of Steam Deck, if that is what you’re asking. If you know how to make isos and move them over if the game requires, you can install windows on the steam deck and basically run anything that the steam deck can handle hardware wise whether its on steam or not. Ive seen people who installed windows on it or also kept the original Linux Steam OS play many non-steam games. Some of these other devices were built with Windows though from the ground up though if you don’t want to reinstall anything or deal with drivers, I personally plan on getting a Steam Deck here in a few months next Christmas then replacing Linux with Windows so i know for sure my software will work as sacrilegious as it is.
it doesn’t have a disc drive
False. Only the least expensive model has eMMC for the built-in storage. The other models have replaceable (upgradable) NVMe SSDs.
Lol, wooosh. A disc drive is an optical drive like a Blu-ray, DVD, or cd drive. Go ahead,show me the built in disc drive on a steam deck and not a USB connected one.
Maybe this is an age thing? Not a lot of hardware comes with an optical drive anymore.
I haven’t bought a game on optical media since 2003, that being Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne
Likewise… I haven’t bought a game on optical media since the Wii.
Hm… I’ve never bought PC software on a disc…!?
And yet I have all these old Windows & Office & game discs… Man, hoarding tech is a weird habit.
Wait, do you guys still use optical disc drives on pc? What year is it? 2000?
Man, I hear “disc drive” & I think “hard disc drive”. I’ve connected optical drives when USB boot wasn’t supported, but the last time I voluntarily used a disc drive was to test an M-Data disc burned to silicon. But yeah, none of these new devices have a HDD or optical (or floppy disk, for that matter).
Oh, I obviously interpreted that as meaning a hard disk drive (which SSDs are still commonly referred to as HDDs) since we were discussing modern PCs. Many years ago external physical file transfer mostly transitied away from using actual spinning disks to USB storage, and even that has been mostly supplanted by network connected storage for several years.
Those are not discs.
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It’s a gif, I had to tap on it before it played (on Jerboa)
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