80% of soy is fed to animals for humans to exploit, so not really sure what you’re getting at.

A plant based diet eliminates the vast majority of animal suffering (bonus points for reduced climate destruction, antibiotic degradation and future pandemic likelihood)

I’d counter that with Earthling Ed, who’s entirely rational and reasonable, while some of the people debating him are pretty scary characters https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCVRrGAcUc7cblUzOhI1KfFg

Thanks, that’s a really interesting piece. I don’t interpret that it’s really about bias though, he’s gone through to offer to some more ideas for context. The takeaway seems to be that while the OWID stats are accurate, historical context changes that changes the way people lived and would be good to add - it’s really clever, but I don’t think there’s much to suggest there’s anything nefarious. In times where we are presented with outright lies, it still seems to me to be a source which shines light

Could you reference some of these claims that our world in data was found to be biased? Sounds like a pretty solid judgement was made, but a cursory search didn’t yield anything untoward. Maybe if it’s definite, you could update the Wikipedia entry to reference the controversy, as that’s always a good place to signpost that kind of thing.

Exactly, good for you. As individuals, we can choose to make things better, be a part of the solution, and have a big collective impact by making changes.

Bonus points are that it sends a signal to others which amplifies the impact, and also reduces the power of those large organisations who do bad, since our better actions often feed them less money.

That makes it sadder. Every one of those is an individual whose entire birth, life and death was for a sandwich, and people could just choose a different sandwich.

So you realise that you’re parroting the same thing all over the place and you know it’s probably not accurate? Here’s a challenge for you - approach this topic like something you’ve not researched before without your existing opinions and try and reach an answer as to whether electric cars are better or worse for the environment by being as scientific and objective as possible.

Because I keep coming across comments similar to yours, I have taken that same challenge myself to make sure I’m on the right track and there was a lack of compelling sources suggesting that electric cars are worse for the environment.

I invite everyone with the alternative view to the same challenge.

This Is Vegan Propaganda: (And Other Lies the Meat Industry Tells You) by Ed Winters. I think it’s tough to read this book and not be vegan before it’s finished, it’s an extremely well considered and compelling book for for anyone who likes having their views challenged.

It changed my life profoundly in both outlook and actions, as it did everybody in my life who I suggested read it.

The full quote for better context:

“Attacks and doxing make me personally MORE likely to support stronger safety features in chromium, as such acts increase my suspicion that there is significant intimidation from criminals who are afraid this feature will disrupt their illegal and/or unethical businesses, and I don’t give in to criminals or bullies.”

Was definitely a huge change for the worst, any recommendations for a replacement widget, since that was the most useful part?

I hear you! It’s frustrating how much is out of our control. I find some people neglect to do what they can because some people, corporations or countries are a larger problem - sorry for mistakenly lumping you in with them!

Private jets are bad, agreed… How about making the change to veganism and also campaigning about private jets at the same time? Picking a different item on a menu is all it takes for a people in a lot of places and it’s t really the type of problem that humanity should be throwing everything at.

15 minutes of pleasure from eating doesn’t justify forcing an animal into existence to a life of suffering and premature death, especially when there are so many great alternatives - without even considering the the secondary effects of animal agriculture, including climate damage, antibiotic resistant bacteria, and the likelihood of bringing forward the next pandemic.

I do maintain that even if not everybody realises its benefits, is fooled by the terrible marketing etc., going vegan and lowering consumption is still a great solution for those who choose to refuse to be a part of the problem. I think it’s one of those challenges that we have to throw as much as we can at through every angle possible, even while it’s not going to be perfect. Perhaps we can buy some time for other solutions to join the fight.

Also, yes, definitely not having children is going to be the biggest change I expect (unless the child happens to help be a part of a bigger solution of course), but I’d certainly recommend veganism either as a great addition or for parents without time machines or those who have grown fond of their kids. Also, if nobody had kids, it would create other problems about who would look after the elderly etc., but that’s another debate!

I don’t think enough people have made enough effort to cut down (or preferably stop) meat, and animal products, and still see incredible amounts of waste, SUVs etc. Admitedly it’s old data, but a minority of surveyed Americans were eating less meat in year 2020 - https://news.gallup.com/poll/282779/nearly-one-four-cut-back-eating-meat.aspx. - not sure if the outlook is any better.

I totally agree with direct action and democracy, though I do maintain that the number one change people can make is to go vegan, as the lead author of the biggest meta study of its type concludes https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2018-06-01-new-estimates-environmental-cost-food

Importantly, I still agree that you are spot on that voting, complaining to companies and advocacy is incredibly important, but I just also feel that it is people who can choose not to buy the most damaging products (e.g. animal products) from those companies to accelerate more sustainable markets.

It’s just not true that we can’t make a difference though - it’s just easier for people to think that. Even if corporations, China, people on private jets etc. are damaging Earth and its inhabitants, our habits still make a difference also. You know, we can do what we can do personally at the same time as voting, campaigning and protesting for the change we can’t control.

Reduction is a really impactful thing to do for the reasons you’ve outlined, though “a vegan diet is probably the single biggest way to reduce your impact on planet Earth, not just greenhouse gases, but global acidification, eutrophication, land use and water use”, according to the scientists behind the most comprehensive analysis to date comparing the impact of food production. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/325532198_Reducing_food’s_environmental_impacts_through_producers_and_consumers