https://teddit.zaggy.nl/r/Psychonaut/comments/18mth6c/peyote_is_the_darling_of_the_psychedelics/
Honestly this whole thread is a cesspool, pure psychic damage. There are literally functional alternatives, but still these self-enlightened egolords can’t keep their fucking hands off an endangered plant. The prevailing attitude looks to be “Its there, so I i am entitled to plunder it”
As someone who loved drugs back in the day, I always told people that they should grow their own San Pedro’s or another common mescaline cactus and not peyote. I know a guy whose entire house is filled with different species of peyote, literally every inch of his floor covered in pots. He had trichoceruses he kept for tripping. If it didn’t keep him busy and happy with himself, I’d say it was a hoard. But he was growing for repopulation and regularly planted around town, so it’s healthy-ish for him. Got himself off heroin by growing peyote for repopulation, not by taking it. He was the only white guy I’ve ever met that taking peyote would be perfectly ethical, but still didn’t do it
It’s not hard to be respectful. Especially when San Pedros are legal and extremely easy to get.
Removed by mod
is pandanas an endangered species? the cactus is.
If whitey wants peyote, whitey should grow it on his own land, it’s all stolen anyway.
Removed by mod
No one should be harming the plants in that case
except for the indigenous people who have used it for over 5000 years with no problem right??
Removed by mod
Indigenous growers know how to harvest the plant safely. The problem comes from colonizers taking the whole plant or clumsily over harvesting and killing it
Tigers also harvest pretty poorly
Sure, but Peyote takes 10-30 years to grow in a very specific climate, and is endangered due to overharvesting. Growing your own is one thing, but exploiting an endangered plant and telling the groups that use it to “Grow it on their own land” is blatant colonizer behavior.
also if you use magic mushrooms you have a moral duty to know what happened to María Sabina
aww what the hell, fuckin kkkrackers
TIL about the MKUltra connection to what happened to her
thats the part that gets me!! how is the cia at the crime of EVERY bad thing in Latin America.
If something happened in South America in the last 80 or so years, “CIA did it” is an appropriate response 99% of the time.
Tbh whites should not use magic mushrooms at all.
Tbh whites should not use magic mushrooms at all.
How deep does this argument go? Should white people also not use synthetic psilocybin as a migraine prophylactic? Psilocybin or derivatives shouldn’t be used to treat depression?
I agree that the dominant psychedelic culture (especially in amerikkka) fucking sucks, is riddled with abuse
I guess I’m just having trouble following the argument that because the CIA and associated colonizers committed atrocious acts to Sabina and her family and community every other imperial subject should cease using a compound (or derivatives) that humanity has historically used in Europe, Asia, and Africa.
i read somewhere i cant find it now, that it didnt matter if outsiders use the drug because the magic has already been killed
but if the indigenous people thats use it say otherwise or change their mind yes 100% no question. anyone using peyote outside of the church approval is i giant piece of shit.
Watched some Crime Pays But Botany Doesn’t about “growing cactus from seed” and it’s about indigenous people growing peyote (and other cacti).
They’re already overharvested and dying out in the wild. Fuck off white psychonauts.
Love this channel
Typical white pig doesn’t understand why he can’t eat all of a sacred endangered plant that takes 30 years to grow.
OINK OINK MUST CONSUME.
THE TREATS MUST FLOW
the treats must flow as easily as this badly photoshopped image of microcars I made where the cars are 5x smaller in order to give the illusion that expanding car lanes would increase transit productivity
I don’t think it’s a matter of gate keeping the drug do much as it is of keeping the plant from going extinct due to over harvesting. Grow your own peyote (most won’t bc they lack the necessary skills and patience, even if they have an appropriate climate) or just use other psychedelics.
tacit attempts at virtue-blackmailing
this redditor has no concept of shame leftTBF, I’ve abandoned shame in myself as well, I see it as a form of social control I don’t need or want in myself. The main problem is that they didn’t decide not to feel shame, they just became immune due to an over-abundance. That was their only moral check, was not looking bad to others. Once they lost it they have nothing holding back their appetites.
sounds good and healthy tbh - and yet you still know the word shame. What I felt was so funny about the part I quoted is, that it seemed like the guy struggled to verbalize the very concept of shaming and as such defaulted to construct something with a virtue-component (that’s what the libs have right) and ended up with this hilariously over-complex-yet-primitive turn of phrase. Virtue-blackmailing alone just kinda sent me
Not saying shame is a good thing to cultivate or w/e
Oh, gotcha
Although Anderson sympathized with the landowners, who wished to make their land productive and protect themselves from litigation by anyone who was injured on their ranch while collecting peyote, the closure of peyote harvesting grounds produced “serious tensions” between indigenous people and the ranchers. According to Salvador Johnson, the largest peyote distributor in Texas, 100 percent of the land in Texas where peyote grows is privately owned, which means that if peyoteros are going to harvest peyote, they need permission from landowners.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/zmdzbw/the-decline-of-american-peyote-v24n5
I read the original article and the only thing I have against it is the anti-synthetic peyote stance they have. I get it’s a sacred plant but if the option is people foraging it to extinction or letting them have a lab grown version then just let them make it in the lab. As much as I support indigenous folks in their anti-crakkker stance they don’t have the right to the molecule itself especially if it isn’t derived from peyote.
I assume that’s the point of the first comment. Not “Let me forage this plant to extinction” but “If you say I can’t have a synthetic version and I can’t forage then what do you want me to do?” Just let them have the lab-grown stuff and keep the plants yourself. Less foraging, psych folks get their trips, everyone’s happy.
Yeah i re-read the article a few times and came to a similar conclusion. At the same time - if they have an issue with white colonizers using synthetic
Peyotemescaline, is that not also worth consideration and empathy? It subverts the supply issue, but it feels to me (as a white colonizer) like approptiation of someone’s culture, against the protest of the people who’s culture is being appropriated.Should we really be forcing onto any indigenous peoples our views of whats “fair”? There exist many alternatives to mescaline, and I think their desire to not have it commodified and shared should be respected.
Appropriation isn’t a marxist criticism. Stop using it in this way if you’re going to keep saying it.
Can you help me understand what you mean, or point me in the right direction? I’m not exactly a well-read Marxist and I’m not trying to hide it
Appropriation is a value-neutral concept. And also not rooted in exploitation per se. There’s an erroneous conflation here between colonialist appropriation which does material harm to the people being colonized as well as possibly being a component to the ideology of colonialism (like Israel taking Palestinian culture into itself to use as a justification of their superiority to them) which marxism will sometimes talk about, versus neutral appropriation like white people using synthetic peyote or American teenagers making vaporwave from '80s J-Pop.
It’s not inherently disrespectful to use things without chaining ourselves to the original contexts they were used in. It can sometimes be harmful and/or disrespectful but idpol liberals literally only care about turning anti-imperialism and morality into arbitrary dinner etiquette. So they just call it all cultural appropriation and tell people not to do arbitrary things.
Good post!
