• jaybone@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    How does this happen? Like people on the forum get into some argument about the turn radius of some tank and how they shouldn’t have lost a game, and then it escalates until someone posts the tank specs so they can be right on the internet?

    • mctoasterson@reddthat.com
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      5 months ago

      Yes. This is apparently so much of a problem that US and other nations include this in security training for military personnel and contractors. They literally teach you not to get in arguments online about weapons capabilities and whatnot because they know people are dumb enough to post classified info just so they can be like “ackshually…” on an internet forum.

    • Nythos@sh.itjust.works
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      5 months ago

      From what I’ve seen it’s usually that Gaijin have something wrong about the vehicle and so people leak actual classified information because they want it to be corrected.

      MilSim people can be an odd bunch sometimes

      • Kecessa@sh.itjust.works
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        5 months ago

        And the devs are like “Are you fucking dumb? We won’t use classified info in our game.”

        • bleistift2@sopuli.xyz
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          5 months ago

          Well if it’s something like a turn radius, they can always claim that they just guessed right.

          • Liz@midwest.social
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            5 months ago

            Are they under any obligation to protect the classified information if they’re not the ones who leaked it?

            • PM_Your_Nudes_Please@lemmy.world
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              5 months ago

              Knowingly owning or using classified info without proper clearance is, in fact, a crime.

              That’s a large part of what Trump’s classified document raid was for. Former presidents usually have a lot of classified stuff to turn over after leaving office. It’s standard practice, (and perfectly legal) to simply send it back (via the proper channels) as soon as you discover you have it. But if you conceal it and refuse to return it (like Trump did) then that’ll land you in some hot water.

              • Liz@midwest.social
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                5 months ago

                It’s my understanding that you’re only required to protect the information if you’ve actually agreed to do so, which is obviously a retirement for being given access. Elected officials are a weird area where they have a much easier time getting clearance, but they’ve still made agreements to protect the information.

                Trump was authorized to handle classified information in the first place, which is why his mishandling was a problem. I haven’t read the actual law, but I’m pretty sure ordinary people who happen across classified information have no duty at all in any direction. If you can show me an example of a random person getting in trouble for sharing classified information that they didn’t steal or get others to steal, well, let me know.

                • jimbolauski@lemm.ee
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                  5 months ago

                  Publishing classified info can get you espionage charges, just ask Julian Assange.

                • lad@programming.dev
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                  5 months ago

                  So, hypothetically, you find a source who leaks data to you, then claim you were sent it anonymously, then all good, you’re not the one who leaked it and the source is unknown. I slightly doubt that it works that way, but I don’t have specific cases to prove it

              • CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org
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                5 months ago

                AFAIK it’s part of being given some clearance. In most Western countries it’s fine to republish already leaked material as a private citizen. How would the media do it otherwise?

              • Madison420@lemmy.world
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                5 months ago

                No, his problem is that he was supposed to have access at some point wherein you agree to secure documents in certain ways. If you’re given it or find it you do not have that duty. Defense secrets are much more protected but still not that much of you aren’t supposed to have access.

            • YtA4QCam2A9j7EfTgHrH@infosec.pub
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              5 months ago

              No. You can publish it if you like. This is how journalists work. You cannot get someone to commit a crime towards getting classified documents (Assange tried to teach people to hack shit and pled guilty to this). But accepting them and publishing them is fine and good.

            • lad@programming.dev
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              5 months ago

              While they are, as stated by another commenter, I wonder if those documents count as working in intelligence and they have some External Security Colonel working on “moderation”

      • lepinkainen@lemmy.world
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        5 months ago

        Yea, I had a friend who spent his free time coding how different tarmac temperatures affect the wheels of a fighter plane in a flight sim. (DCS I think)

    • ILikeBoobies@lemmy.ca
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      5 months ago

      One time it was a Chinese player pissed that their tank ammo wasn’t as strong as it should be so they posted it for the devs to buff

    • EldritchFeminity@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      5 months ago

      It’s sometimes this, and it’s sometimes Gaijin just claiming something is classified for whatever reason.

      Sometimes, a British tank crewman posts technical specs from their manual for the Challenger 2. Sometimes, Gaijin claims that a declassified, internationally available manual for a Cold War era plane is classified. Or the Wikipedia article on a WW2 tank.

    • Heavybell@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      Yes. Supposedly it’s so bad that Raytheon includes the question “Do you or have you ever played War Thunder?” in their interviews now. Tho take that with a huge grain of salt.

    • johannesvanderwhales@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      That and the game is popular among military and ex-military members.

      IIRC the reporting fudges the definition of “classified” a bit too.

    • Thann@lemmy.ml
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      5 months ago

      Asked me to disable my adblocker, but I’m just runnng vanadium lol

    • rambling_lunatic@sh.itjust.works
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      5 months ago

      "This marks one of three leaks that have happened in the past week, though not all of them are directly tied to War Thunder. The first related to the release of documents on the Challenger British main battle tanks on the game’s forum, though that information was confirmed to be publically [sic] available from Britain’s National Archive."

      • ElCanut@jlai.luOP
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        5 months ago

        Why would you call “leak” the disclosure of publicly available information?

        • lad@programming.dev
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          5 months ago

          There are at least two court cases I know, where the accusation is of leaking sensitive government info, while the info is publicly available. One is in Russia, and it’s kind of expected, considering what a bastion of free speech it is. One is in Estonia

    • rtxn@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      The leak happened earlier this week during a forum discussion regarding the T-90M, T-80BVM, and T-90S Russian main battle tanks, all of which are currently in service and appear in War Thunder itself. The documents shared are user manuals meant for those operating said vehicles and have, like most other military documents, been declared classified or sensitive even though they contain relatively surface-level information.

      • dactylotheca@suppo.fi
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        5 months ago

        For fucking once it’s not idiots leaking western stuff. I’m like halfway convinced War Thunder is a Russian intelligence operation

        • CarbonIceDragon@pawb.social
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          5 months ago

          tbf, if I ran an intel agency, after all these incidents, Id probably have someone “leak” fake classified docs on the warthunder forums or other similar places once in a blue moon, to spread misleading information to rival agencies as to the capabilities of my nation’s equipment. Both to blend in with a place idiots are known to actually post such info, and if its found out my agency was doing this, to cast doubt on the validity of any real docs from my side that were leaked before. Doesnt seem like itd cost much of anything to do, so there would have to be only minimal benefit to be marginally worth it

        • Skua@kbin.earth
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          5 months ago

          There have been two leaks about Chinese tanks and two about Russian jets even before this one, so while it’s mostly Western gear it’s not only that

          • dactylotheca@suppo.fi
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            5 months ago

            Oh yeah I know there’s been other leaks before, just that most of the time it seems like it’s western gear and it’s a refreshing change

        • FMEEE@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          5 months ago

          Not even the stupidest Take. Gijin is a Hungarian game studio and Hungarian Govt is more or less pro Russian.

        • pyre@lemmy.world
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          5 months ago

          it’s just morons trying to prove something. people don’t join the army because they’re too happy with who they are.

        • Delta_V@lemmy.world
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          5 months ago

          Ukrainian farmer: “How do I put this hunk of junk into Neutral so I can load it onto my trailer?” *starts an argument on War Thunder forums*

          • rtxn@lemmy.world
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            5 months ago

            Good ol’ Murphy’s Law: the quickest way to find correct information is to post incorrect information on the internet and wait for the inevitable “ackshyually”.

  • Th4tGuyII@fedia.io
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    5 months ago

    Honestly these guys are both the smartest and stupidest folks imaginable at the same time - I’m just glad it’s the Russians they’re screwing over this time haha

    • AlexisFR@jlai.lu
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      5 months ago

      If they were smart, they wouldn’t be playing Warthunder in 2024, tho

      • Artyom@lemm.ee
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        5 months ago

        Ah yes, they must be playing that other historically accurate plane combat game whose name I totally forgot because it actually doesn’t exist and War Thunder is the only option.

      • psud@aussie.zone
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        5 months ago

        There was a Ukrainian Bradley fighting vehicle gunner who took down a Russian main battle tank with the anti-personnel machine gun, and thanked his time playing war thunder for knowing where to hit it when he had no anti-armour and no armour piercing ammo

        He took out its optics and turret control

          • psud@aussie.zone
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            5 months ago

            Yeah, I couldn’t recall whether it was an autocannon or machine gun, but it was not loaded with depleted uranium ammo

    • uis@lemm.ee
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      5 months ago

      Is it Ponedelnik, Vtornik, Sreda, Chetverg, Pyatnitsa, Subbota or Voskresenye?

  • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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    5 months ago

    They just needs to write alien spaceships and then we’d find out about what’s really in area 51 within about a week.

  • nifty@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    How’s that place not just a den of glowies by now? Bet you can see it from fucking space

  • mindbleach@sh.itjust.works
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    5 months ago

    How WarThunder was funded:

    CIA guy: “So y’know how Wikipedia became a trustworthy source of obscure information just by weaponizing pedantry?”

    NSA guy: “I’m listening.”

  • biggerbogboy@sh.itjust.works
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    5 months ago

    This issue is so common that one of my best friends had intentionally leaked the specs of a classified jet to prove a point, funny af honestly

  • TheReturnOfPEB@reddthat.com
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    5 months ago

    there should be the goal of having no standing national military on the planet by the middle of the 21st century

    they are the tools of tyrants